Suprisingly not a moan!

[Raiser]

Some players/pit bosses are still unsure of some reoccuring rules and it seems that the player with the loudest voice at the table gets heard... the rules that need clarifying are:

1) the one about the SB being knocked out and whos blinds are next.
2) claffification of how to bet! i.e. you cant say "I call all in"....

& i am sure there are more i have missed

I am not looking for answers as iam aware of the rules however i think somthing physical with the rules that ALL LPL games use is needed at the games...

So my suggestion would be to have a laminated sheet of the all of the rules at every venue - so that just in case some players are unsure atleast the pitboss has some back up and can say "i dont make the rules, but these are the ones we all follow"

All good brands need standards

[DonkBox]

one option would be to use roberts' rule of poker (you can find thsi online mike, or anyone else) which can be condense/simplified and dprinted out and perhaps given to each venue?

[s4ooter]

roberts rules is the best one i know of too, u have to have clarification i hate it when u have players shoutin over one another and evryone thinks they are suddenly an expert on all the rules!! if u aint a clue then shut the fcuk up!!!

[Alex_B]

Another one that came up last night in Bath was after the river when the betting was complete, one person turns over a card to show top pair but then threw the other card on the muck pile.

I think most people are aware of it now, but can everyone in the LPL remember that to win the hand (when another person at the table has called after the river) you have to show BOTH cards to actually win the pot. The result of it last night was that the person who threw their second card into the muck pile, actually had to forfeit the hand as they didn't show both cards and therefore couldn't claim the pot. On this occasion there wasn't a great deal in the pot and it was taken very well by the person who had to muck the hand, but on another occasion if there were all-ins or a very large pot, it could cause problems.

I think with the prizes that are at stake at the moment, everyone is sticking completely to the rules, so maybe we should have a set of poker rules printed and given to each venue; I would be happy to go with Roberts Rules as well.

Mike, is it possible to get a copy printed for each venue in case moments such as this one and the ones above crop up?

[LPL_Mike]

Originally Posted by askldfhj

Some players/pit bosses are still unsure of some reoccuring rules and it seems that the player with the loudest voice at the table gets heard... the rules that need clarifying are:

1) the one about the SB being knocked out and whos blinds are next.
2) claffification of how to bet! i.e. you cant say "I call all in"....

& i am sure there are more i have missed

I am not looking for answers as iam aware of the rules however i think somthing physical with the rules that ALL LPL games use is needed at the games...

So my suggestion would be to have a laminated sheet of the all of the rules at every venue - so that just in case some players are unsure atleast the pitboss has some back up and can say "i dont make the rules, but these are the ones we all follow"

All good brands need standards

All the organisers who run the LPL events sometimes have a thankless task, as the rules of Poker can become complex (law degree needed)

The concept of the rules at the LPL maybe considered basic which serves the purpose as not to confuse new players and make the playing experience fun for all (we are not a casino)..but sometimes a rule will throw up a curve ball!

When a new venue comes on board and when the person running the event is also quite new, discussions over the rules might take place, in normal circumstances the rules would be explained and the game would then carry on but on occasion the person may not be sure on what to do, this will be discussed maybe the next day with myself and the organizer and the rules clarified.


Any rules that come to light that may cause confusion, common sense should prevail.
i.e the rule Alex was talking about over in Bath where a player has to show both cards in a non contested pot is a rule we can now add and clear up

1. A player must show all cards in the hand face-up on the table to win any part of the pot.

This rule is very clear and easy to understand, the confusion comes into it to how far we apply these rules?
If a new person who plays shows the winning card and mucks the other card, do we grab the rules and point and say hard luck you folded?...or as he clearly won the hand we allow the pot to be taken but explain the rule for next time???

To be honest when i play cash games i sometimes will show just the winning card, and then muck the second but only when the other player has indicated i have won the hand..now a player may pull me up and asked me to show my other card..but i have never lost a pot due to this.

Now if the player showed top pair 'aces' and mucked one card only for his opponant to also show a Ace then the player who mucked the card loses the hand because he cannot prove he had a better kicker..that rule is black and white...and should be applied to the letter of the law.

I guess what i am trying to say that some rules are clearly black and white, if a player mucks his cards by mistake ..he can't go into the muck pile to retrieve them!
If a player mucks his cards and they land on an opponants cards those cards should also be mucked...Black and White? or do we just continue with the game?

We have a lot of new players come to the LPL to enjoy an evening out, these players wont know the diference between a string bet and a full house, but over time can be helped by the more experience players to not only enjoy the game but also learn about the game....

[Alex_B]

Originally Posted by LPL_Mike

i.e the rule Alex was talking about over in Bath where a player has to show both cards in a non contested pot is a rule we can now add and clear up

Just so we're completely clear; it WAS a contested pot.

And if it had been a newcomer to the LPL (ie first time playing in the league or first time playing poker altogether); we would have explained the rules rather than made the decision that was made.

Mike - we generally have 40 players at The Assembly on a Tuesday and Thursday, with sometimes a waiting list of another 5 people. I personally don't believe that any other venue is more inviting or encouraging to new players than we are, which is why even after a year of playing at The Assembly, we are still getting 3 or 4 new players every week.

[DonkBox]

I think common sense needs to prevail. For instance already this month i remember Dan being very gracious when the flop came K-8-8 and a player went all in with A-Q whilst Dan had K-K and the player (not a newcomer) threw his cards (face up) onto the muck pile (not intetntionally folding just furstrated at going all-in stupidly)

The turn and river were both aces, giving the other player a bigger boat, Dan graciously gave the player the pot but would've been quite within his rights to rake it himself.

The showing one card and folding happens all the time usually player A shows one card e.g top pair, player B mucks and player A rakes the pot and folds their other card. This is perfectly legal, because player B has mucked, but the other players should (i usually do) ask to see the winning players other card, if only for information, as they are within their rights to do so.

In fact they are also within their rights to see the losing players cards if they have not touched the muck pile.

[Raiser]

Originally Posted by LPL_Mike

I guess what i am trying to say that some rules are clearly black and white

Yes agreed.... all i was asking was would it be possible to have these 'black & white rules' in black and white on some lovely LPL/poker.co.uk headed paper and laminated (ok laminate isnt that neccessary but it would keep for a while!) and keep one in the pit bosses lovely box of tricks so that when there is any incident where twenty different rules are being shouted out every can refer to these rules Also it owuld mean every venue in every region is standardisied.

I didnt mean this thread to sound like a moan - it was more of a suggestion on how to solve an occuring problem.

[Raiser]

I will take that as a no then!

Was just being constructive as oppossed to slagging everything off like 70% of people on here do! I will keep my mouth shut next time!

[LPL_Mike]

Originally Posted by askldfhj

I will take that as a no then!

Was just being constructive as oppossed to slagging everything off like 70% of people on here do! I will keep my mouth shut next time!

I thought i had answered you here:

When a new venue comes on board and when the person running the event is also quite new, discussions over the rules might take place, in normal circumstances the rules would be explained and the game would then carry on but on occasion the person may not be sure on what to do, this will be discussed maybe the next day with myself and the organizer and the rules clarified.

I think the idea is a good one for new venues to have a set of rules i think it would help a lot, most of the other venues where the organiser has been running the venue can deal with most if not all the queries there and then, it would only really effect new venues.

I will look at getting something sorted